I went to a CRC church that was also strong on ex communication if you strayed or “didn’t fit the vision”. They divided families and stopped church members communicating with those who had been booted out or left of their own accord. They were also were quite hysterical about people of the opposite sex being together in case they kissed (!) and various rules were devised to avoid same. And not that I directly experienced this, but I’m pretty sure homosexuality was worthy of deliverance ministry in the first instance if not ex communication. Our church claimed to be THE holders of the truth along with some other pentecostal churches they deemed acceptable and had aligned with. Other denominations were commonly preached from the pulpit as cults. Unlike the Revivalist Centres, our CRC didn’t say you had to speak in tongues to be saved but it was encouraged as a sign of being “spirit filled”. If you didn’t attend the increasing number of meetings and church commitments, you were looked down upon despite the fact that it was unrealistic to do that and have a life outside the church. The amount of control exercised over the congregation was high and there was a repeated message given that the only life was within the church. Taking that factor and all the others into account, I’d define our church as cultish. Wouldn’t you?

On the issue of whether people have to speak in tongues to be saved, there is a very important text to bear in mind.

1 Cor 12:30 asks among other things “Do all speak in tongues?” Whenever a question is asked in the original Greek, you can tell from the Greek whether a “yes” or “no” answer is expected. If “ou” is used, a “yes” answer is expected. If “me” (i.e. with a long “e”) a “no” answer is expected.

In this verse when Paul asks “Do all speak in tongues?”, the word “me” is used and Paul is expecting the answer “no”. All do not speak in tongues. In fact in all of the questions in verses 29 and 30, Paul uses “me” each time, and is expecting a “no” answer to all of them.

eg v 29 “Are all apostles? -(no), are all prophets? (no), are all teachers? (no), Do all work miracles? – (No), Do all have gifts of healing? (no), Do all speak in tongues? (No), Do all interpret? (No).

This proves that not all christians speak in tongues and it is certainly not necessary for salvation.

Note Paul’s injunction in V 31, “But eagerly desire the greater gifts”.

I hope this helps.

(I am a Retired Baptist Pastor)

As another former RCA (now split into RCI and RCF) member, I agree their practices are cultish, however, I’m cautious about using the term “cult” to describe any group that does not conform to mainstream theology.

I believe the accepted term in Psychology is “high demand group”. This term is less emotionally connotated, and helps those who have come out of such a group more able to process their experiences, and deal with the high levels of grief or loss that is often evident after coming out. The danger associated with using the term “cult” is that many ex-members will feel stigmatised for the rest of their life, and may forever view their time spent in such a group as wasted, when the reality is that many do enjoy their time therein, and can even be enriched by their “life experiences” within the group. The trick is always having the correct positive mindset, and being able to see the bigger picture in your life.

After all, life is a journey, isn’t it?

I hope these small insights help

You are correct in saying that it’s important to acknowledge all the good, bad and ugly experiences in a high demand group (if I can borrow from Clint Eastwood’s movie). I think from a Christian point of view we also need to include forgiveness in the equation. It’s very easy to become embittered, and there needs to be a reappraisal of our beliefs and values which are often antagonistic, hostile and judgemental towards such groups when we come out. The victim mentality is also another syndrome many ex-members experience when they leave a high demand group.

I’ve read that the great thing about forgiveness is that it releases us from the prison that we created that was originally intended for our perpetrators. That’s not to deny the right to natural justice. There needs to be accountability and restitution for those abused, but this alone is not enough – we need to take that extra step of forgiving our perpetrators in a Christ like way that paves the way for healing, and allows us to be reconciled. I guess the penultimate example of this was when Jesus forgave his executioners just before he died. What a wonderful example for us to follow.

As another former RCA (now split into RCI and RCF) member, I agree their practices are cultish, however, I’m cautious about using the term “cult” to describe any group that does not conform to mainstream theology.

I believe the accepted term in Psychology is “high demand group”. This term is less emotionally connotated, and helps those who have come out of such a group more able to process their experiences, and deal with the high levels of grief or loss that is often evident after coming out. The danger associated with using the term “cult” is that many ex-members will feel stigmatised for the rest of their life, and may forever view their time spent in such a group as wasted, when the reality is that many do enjoy their time therein, and can even be enriched by their “life experiences” within the group. The trick is always having the correct positive mindset, and being able to see the bigger picture in your life.

After all, life is a journey, isn’t it?

I hope these small insights help

Welcome notinacult….clever username…..hehe.

yes cult is a strong word…..we have several people here who come from the Revival Centres of Australia (not Christian Revival Centres CRC) Lloyd Longfield split with Leo Harris (founder of CRC) over the issue of you had to speak in tongues to be saved. ….and also British Isrealite teaching I believe.

I was familiar with the congregation in Dubbo and also Newcastle. They tried to start up a church when I was pioneering churches for the AOG in the Port Macquarie area. Very strong in street ministry…as soon as someone made a decision for Christ they were immediately baptised…..sometimes in a bath tub….and had to speak in tongues immediately or within the week…..if not they usually left.

Possibly when a group of people say we are the true believers and the only way to salvation is through our church……then it becomes a cult be definition (this may include the Catholic churches teaching) . Enormous mind control and group dynamics come into play and close people off from reality. Very sad and very dangerous.