I’ve been getting these messages in Facebook from a person I used to go to church with long years ago. Now he is married and is doing his PhD and I’m drained emotionally, please HELP me.

Hey Johann, long time no hear… and I see that you’re still banging away on your pro gay drum. Mate, I am concerned about you and in particular, your last comment “The ones who are the most anti gay are the ones that seem to be gay themselves and are fighting “the good fight” instead of accepting themselves for who they are and living at peace with themselves.” Chum that is not only an improper use of scripture (fighting the good fight would be to resist sin and trust God not embrace sin and reject God) but this statement also rejects the very reason for Christ’s death and resurrection.

Johann, after I walked away from the church (not Jesus) I went on a rampage, beating people up, hospitalising them and loved every minute of it! I loved to shed blood (anyone’s) and get it on my clothing – it was like a trophy to me… Now if I took on your same mindset “just accept yourself for the way you are” then folk would be in constant danger of being beaten up whenever I felt like lashing out… But that WAS the way I was…. why should I change…? Because it was ungodly and unpleasing to the Lord, it was the work of Satan and opposed the work of the cross, just like homosexuality. What about others such as murders, drug pushers, rapist or those that sexually abuse children…? Now we are getting closer to home… They too could say “accept me for the way that I am.” That mindset is idolatry, where “they” determined what is right in “their” own mind!

Remember when Israel did that, recorded in the book of Judges; do you remember what God said about it…? Johann, 20 years ago homosexuality was classed in the same way as child pornography being unnatural, corrupt and illegal, yet through our immorality, it is accepted (by some anyway). I wonder whether in another 10 or 20 years, child sex will also be legalised too. Would that then make it right? Of course not!

Johann, the scriptures are clear about who God is and His requirements, so I promise you, God did not say to you “accept yourself for who you are;” that was rather a demon. Anything that goes against God’s word is of the spirit of antichrist. God said “accept My Son…” and to truly do that we must also accept His word FULLY. The church and neither I condemn you, but rather warn LOUDLY.

Believing me ole mate, you do not want to go to Hell; to make such a statement only proves that you know nothing about it. I would not be living my life, taking the change that I may not enter glory for ANY sin or for ALL the pressures of this world… not on your life! This life is way too short and eternity is way too long and Hell is way too hot to play that Russian roulette (games with God)! You don’t have to “hope” that you’ll enter heaven, for you can “know” and be with Jesus on that day, but first you must accept Him FULLY. Jesus isn’t coming back for the lukewarm or fence sitters (those that practise sin). And there will be no surprises in regards to homosexuals on that day either… scripture is very very clear. Your last statement, “let him without the first sin…” is misquoted. We all have fallen short, yes, and we have all missed the mark… that is why we need Jesus and that is why we MUST break away from our sin (stop practising sin). No one is throwing stones Johann, but rather warning… The choice is yours, just don’t be deceived about the consequences of taking the dark path of practising homosexuality.

Bro, The reason you haven’t been able to overcome this sin is because you are inflicted by a demonic spirit! If you want to be free, I’ll fly up there a cast it out. The choice is yours; don’t ever say “you didn’t have a choice, for scripture again says that there will be none with excuse on that day. To hang onto your sin is to commit another…”idolatry” and another “not loving God with all your heart” so if homosexuality won’t cut you off (and it will) these other sins will.

Everything is a choice, like you say, you have made yours. Romans 1:24-27 will be the result if your don’t repent.

So God said, in effect, “If that’s what you want, that’s what you get.” It wasn’t long before they were living in a pigpen, smeared with filth, filthy inside and out. And all this because they traded the true God for a fake god, and worshiped the god they made instead of the God who made them—the God we bless, the God who blesses us. Oh, yes! Worse followed. Refusing to know God, they soon didn’t know how to be human either—women didn’t know how to be women, men didn’t know how to be men. Sexually confused, they abused and defiled one another, women with women, men with men—all lust, no love. And then they paid for it, oh, how they paid for it—emptied of God and love, godless and loveless wretches.

Don’t be deceived Johann.

Bro, how do you say that you are serving and loving God when you denounce Christianity? You say that you’d rather live a life of honesty, however you are not. You say that you are being used by God but you live your life contrary to Scripture. Have you not read Matthew 7:21-23? They too thought that they were living a life pleasing unto God yet God never knew them. And again the Pharisees thought that they were living a life unto God, but Jesus warned them of hell. Their many works would never amount to enough to save them.

BTW, God is not a God that will send you to hell, you choose that path all on your own… you said it yourself “you don’t mind going there and you are choosing to do so.” That being the case, how is it that you blame God?

Johann, do you know one of the main reasons that I left the church…? One night while at Westside a visiting preacher came and was preaching about the Holy Spirit and said “if you have ever blasphemed the Holy Spirit you are going straight to hell!” Sadly that preacher didn’t clarify that statement, probably because he didn’t understand what he was talking about in the first place. What’s worst, I had cursed the Holy Spirit only a few weeks beforehand, knowing nothing of this blasphemy business. After the meeting, under great distress, I asked one of the leaders “how do you know if you have blasphemed the Holy Spirit?” His answer… “Oh you’d know it alright if you have!” Nice one! I went white! That night cost me over 15 years of fear, living my life in fear of going to hell. That’s the danger of folk not being grounded in Scripture, misquoting and misleading others into misery. I lived my life away from the church in fear that I’d hear something of hell “knowing that I was going there.”

Johann, you don’t have to live under the fear of hell, you just have to surrender your life FULLY to God! I envy you that you haven’t lived under the fear of being dammed without hope… you have always had a choice, but you risk being lost because of your sin. Again, God will not go against His Word and His Word is clear on the matter. You are being deceived because you love your sin more than you love God therefore you have exchanged God for a lie. Even God said that He would send strong delusions to those that would not obey Him. God does love you ole mate but that won’t change the outcome of wilful sin. God loved His only Son and even He went to hell to pay for your sin, but if you choose to remain in them, then your rejecting His payment. Obey God’s Word Johann, risking hell for a fleeting sin, regardless of what it is, simply isn’t worth it. Think of it, unending hellfire for a moment of lust! It just doesn’t weigh up.

Re: your caption, I do know who I am… do you know where you are going if you don’t listen? I’m not judging you, but warning. Johann, show me from the Bible where it says that God will accept you in your sin… you should be able too if you are so sure that it won’t cost you your life. Sin cost Jesus His, you can bet your life it will cost you yours! You can delete me, but that won’t change what you have already heard. You stand accountable by that forever. True friends speak the truth. You can repent Johann but you can’t escape. As long as you are hearing this message there is grace enough to change… when the warnings stop then that is when you should be really scared.

Like you say, you have made your choice which blinds you to all truth. You have misquoted the Scripture used and misunderstood my intention as well (I do not hate gays). I guess your eyes will be open “on that day” which will be a great shame.

I guess there are two things to consider. 1. Do you want to keep engaging with him- ie is there a benefit to continued engagement or is his engagement with you feeling like harrassment? and 2. Is there a point to continuing to engage with him.

Sometimes a person’s need to prove their point, or conviction of their own rightness blinds them to other points of view, and further enegagement is both futile and counterproductive.

If it is wearing you out emotionally, you might want to consider blocking him on facebook ( for a while…..?) to give yourself some space.

I say this with all Christian love – you’re friend is a jerk!

LMAO!

Johann…..you’ll see that I put your “friends” email in quote so people can see that it is not you speaking. Hope you are okay with that.

Here are my thoughts.

I wouldn’t have bothered responding except with maybe a simple ‘thank you for your thoughts’ .

I had a former high school friend do a similar thing but not quite as vile as your previous friend from church. Although not far off. He is now in some wierd amercian baptist legalistic church that was set up here in Australia.

We engaged in dialogue for a while….I was always repectful……he was always condemnatory. In the end I sent him a final email explaining what I was about to do and why (without long explanations, bible verses or justification)

Then deleted him, blocked him and set up a rule that all emails from him went directly into delete folder so I never actually know if he has emailed me again. I took the power.

Reading what this guy is saying it is obvious that his is dysfunctional, toxic and has major issues. You need to distance yourself from him.

We only have X amount of time and energy………there are much better ways to use our time and energy. Have you noticed the emotions he triggers in you. This is not healthy for you.

Make sure you have the last word ……..take back your power…….then make sure he can’t contact you again and bring his toxicity into your life.

I’m all for dialogue…..but this person is not a dialoguer…….he is a judgmental condemning ‘christian’.

Interesting side note…..the ‘friend’ that I eventually blocked used be part of a group that occasionally ‘played’ together…….this made me wonder if he has some unresolved issues about his sexuality and is now projecting them on others. This is not an uncommon thing. The recent scandals of anti-gay guys in the the religious world getting caught out with male hookers is just another example.

Absolutely agree with AVB. Dialogue is good. This guy is NOT a dialoguer – he is a condemner, an energy-sucker! Do NOT engage him anymore. If you must, block him. Exactly as AVB said, you only have so much energy and certain people don’t deserve to have any of yours.

All the best, Johann.

Hi there Johann

Life is too short and we are meant to live it abundantly, not as if we are sapped of all energy. God doesn’t want us plagued with self doubt and condemnation. Unfortunately, this guy would sap anyone’s energy and sadly I’ve heard it all before, as many of us have. *sigh*

There’s no point engaging with him on this subject because as avb says he’s not into dialogue. His beliefs are quite fixed and probably not about to change anytime soon. It’s difficult to challenge belief systems, especially when based on the bible. There are too many unanswered questions when we try and read into ancient texts, no matter what our stance.. And even if God appeared in the flesh and told this guy that you are beautiful and not sinful, he might still not believe him.

I’d be blocking your ‘friend’. Do what’s good for you, and as avb says, your emotions can help guide with that.

Blessings,

Ann Maree

I agree with the above statements…

I came out to a close (not anymore) “Christian” friend… She went on about how I need to go to an ex-gay program to “fix and heal you”… When I told her that there was nothing to cure she went on about it being an abomination blah blah blah…

After that convo the bottom of Cronulla beach was looking pretty dandy…

I ended up deleting her off facebook… She re-added herself… But I have blocked her from pretty much everything.

I really can’t understand how people can’t see the damage that they do…

Again… I can only hope that they believe they are doing the right thing… Which is totally the opposite to what actually happens…

Johann… I have a handy link for you: http://www.facebook.com/settings/?tab=privacy&section=block

Hi avb

Yeah good reply. Note how he relies on the “authority of scripture”. Mmmmm – that old chestnut.

The problem with that is it’s still his interpretation of what’s written.. And the biblical scholars I’ve spoken with (about all kinds of topics) have admitted there will always be many things we don’t know because so much has been lost to antiquity. And here is Pastor Paul, in a totally different culture (about as different to middle eastern as you could get), in a different time, without the social nuances, background, climate, language etc, saying he KNOWS with authority what was meant in the bible. And yet, how can he … or any of us? It’s the same when I read some of the pro gay arguments that have massive holes in them. We can all make the mistake of reading into scripture something that isn’t there to suit our own agenda.

Anyway, this pastor can’t be more knowledgable than the greatest biblical scholars/historians, who despite their lives of dedicated study, are realistic and humble enough to say they don’t know. I’d rather have uncertainty and realism than closed minded arrogance.

Very interesting that this comes at this time or does this happen often to you AVB? I’m glad it doesn’t happen too often to me or I’ll be drained emotionally all the time. Do you think his theology would say that AIDS is God’s judgement on gay people? If yes, what would be his reason that the straight community (50% in the world) also have AIDS?

Thanks for the link to block that person, will use it soon for sure, as soon as I’vehad the last word ….but in the mean time, I’m waiting for the right wording to come to me.

Thanks for your love and support.

Hi Yowee

Yes, sadly avb gets these types of letters and emails quite often. That’s why he’s good at answering them.

In regards to the ‘AIDS as judgment ‘ idea, yes no doubt this pastor would believe that thanks to homosexuals, this is a punishment of wrath inflicted not just on the gay community but on innocent others too! So we can blame gays for that because we’re so dangerous on top of being sinners. He’s perhaps using it like the sins of the father argument where generations may suffer because of their ancestors actions.

Do you need to have the last word with this person? I mean I get why it was suggested, as a way of allowing you to take your power back. I guess you have to assess if replying will achieve that for you….it may do … or sometimes it’s better to walk away rather than possibly expose yourself to more emails that may come your way.

Blessings,

Ann Maree