Hi Ben

I didn’t see ‘The Fight’ but must admit I get my hackles up when I hear of Christians tellling others not to do this and that, including masturbation. For young people especially who are told not to have sexual relations before marriage, and especially for those in our community who are not permitted to marry same sex partners, I think it’s unfair and unrealistic for them not to be able to engage in what is a normal and non harming activity. I recall a funny story of a visiting preacher whose topic was masturbation but because of his accent, I thought he was talking about “must-abation” and I thought: ‘Oh this is a good topic. Yes, we do use the words ‘must’ and ‘should’ a lot in our vocabulary and they’re so restrictive and could be used less’. The young people were looking about with confused expressions on their faces and so I happily translated this interpretation to them! I’m not sure they were convinced but I dismissed the idea that a preacher would talk about something so private as masturbation and nag about it from the pulpit. hehe You might say from this that God works in mysterious ways! hehe And on further reflection, I’m betting that those who heard his intended message probably went and masturbated even more thanks to the power of positive suggestion!

As for Simon Riches, ‘sigh’. He seems like a really nice guy, interesting, sincere and engaging. I can see why he believes how his own past abuse might have helped shape his sexuality but sadly, as we know, what happens with one person can’t be generally applied to the rest of the gay population. He appeared so sad and I didn’t buy that he fully believed what he was saying. I mean, I think he was very sincere in wanting to believe. And what’s upsetting to me, is how many people will be influenced by him, wrongly believing that homosexuality is the result of poor paternal bonds or abuse.

Thanks for showing this anyway, Ben. It’s good to be aware of what’s out there.

Blessings,

Ann Maree

Hi sman

Good to hear from you again. Is Roundabout gaining numbers because it’s more subtle than other ex gay things I’ve seen, and also more well presented??

Ann Maree

Hi sman

Yes thanks, you answered my question well. It didn’t sound like you were slandering Adrian at all – just giving a rounded response. I feel so sad about it, the thought of you and others being lumped together with those who had legitimate problems, and also sad for those running the programs, thinking they are being helpful and one day realising the damage caused. *sigh*

Ann Maree

I’ve yet to meet someone in the ex-gay ministry world who doesn’t have a heart. Others might call them evil but those of us who know them personally know they are well intentioned….and genuinely care.

the thing I have the problem with is the outdated misinformation and half truth that is presented in materials like this……not only to gay and lesbian people but also those who love them.

E.G.

1. Sexual abuse makes you gay - they dont mention this theory has been debunked and that many people who were sexually abused are not gay or lesbian


2. If you dont have good parenting it makes you gay they dont mention this theory has been debunked and that most people have imperfect parenting and turn out straight.


3. They don’t speak about the many thousands of gay men and lesbians who are people of faith and live moral lives.

For the last 10 years I’ve been working with people who have come out of ex-gay ministries…….the people they no longer see or have nothing to do with. If they could see into that world then they might be more aware of all the damage they have caused by propagating misinformation and half truths.

• Do they know about the suicides?


• Do they know about the mental health issues?


• Do they know that by saying this is how gay people live that they only gave two alternatives to gay and lesbian christian young people. a.) Follow christ, reject your sexual orientation and be heterosexual. b.) give in to your same sex orientation and live the ‘gay lifestyle’ = lots of sex and drugs…….they have caused people to go down a path of self-destructive behaviours.


• Do they know that the sense of failure and shame their unrealistic expectations contributed to guys being HIV+ today?

these tragedies were not cause by the persons homosexuality but by the impact of years of self-loathing, the internal dissonance of believing that God doesn’t love them as they are….and the sense of failure when they have tried for years to do the impossible….turn from gay to straight.



A very sobering thing is that ……if you believe the words of Jesus

Luke 17; 1-2 .“Hard trials and temptations are bound to come, but too bad for whoever brings them on! Better to wear a millstone necklace and take a swim in the deep blue sea than give even one of these dear little ones a hard time!……then someone will pay for this…..possibly no matter how well intentioned they were……they may say….. ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ Then He will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’